A leaked SCOTUS draft shows that the court is about to overturn Roe vs Wade. Mike Papantonio & Farron Cousins discuss more.


*This transcript was generated by a third-party transcription software company, so please excuse any typos.

Mike Papantonio:             A leaked SCOTUS draft shows that the court’s about to overturn Roe V. Wade. Wow. What a story. I mean, the impact of something like this, first of all, the, the Democrats have gotta be jubilant about it in a lot of ways, because this could affect the midterms. They’re in trouble in the midterms. On the other side, the conservatives say, no, not so fast. This might actually, this might buoy, buoy up the conservatives because the, the, the decision’s gonna come out in June. Right. And the, and then the next move’s gonna be, well, we need to do legislation to change all that. So there’s gonna be that immediate flash point. Why don’t you gimme your thought on what’s happening.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah. I mean, it’s gonna happen actually on both sides too. The Democratic controlled states will say, okay, we need to make sure everything’s open and legal. Republican states are gonna go back and say, listen, we’ve been given clearance now, we can pass our laws and restrict this. And of course, bases on both sides are going to be happy about that. But this decision, you know, what this does and, and I think the best analysis I’ve seen and I, I wish I remembered who to credit this to, is this is not gonna put an end to abortion. This is gonna put an end to safe abortion.

Mike Papantonio:             Ah, yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  Right. You, you’re talking about, you know, the back alley type stuff that could arise from this. Women’s lives could be in danger and that of course is always the concern. And not to mention, just in general, we had this court decision.

Mike Papantonio:             Mm-hmm.

Farron Cousins:                  This was settled.

Mike Papantonio:             Well it’s precedent.

Farron Cousins:                  It was a settled matter.

Mike Papantonio:             It was precedent for decades, man. I mean.

Farron Cousins:                  And so you can’t just throw precedent out the window because if you can, okay, then open season on getting rid of Citizens United.

Mike Papantonio:             Exactly.

Farron Cousins:                  McCutcheon. If, if.

Mike Papantonio:             That, that’s a great point.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah.

Mike Papantonio:             If this happens, I mean, and if this is true. Now look, we all know this. We saw this same thing play itself out with Roberts on Obamacare. Do you remember that?

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah.

Mike Papantonio:             Oh my God. Something was leaked. It wasn’t the, it wasn’t the decision. Just some phrase was leaked and all of a sudden Roberts was going to deep six Obamacare. It was a lie. It was fantasy.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah.

Mike Papantonio:             And now, I don’t know whether Roberts was committed to A and then turned to B, but it never happened. And I, as I watch this, I wonder, is there some similarity here?

Farron Cousins:                  I, I feel like there could be a little bit, or at least perhaps that’s the motive of the leak.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  And so with so many unknowns right now, you know, could this have been a leftist up there that leaked this?

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  That’s a, certainly a possibility. Could it have been a conservative? That’s a possibility, both sides have reason to believe that this decision would help them in the midterms.

Mike Papantonio:             Well.

Farron Cousins:                  And, and you know, one of the analyses I saw from an article from Slate actually talked about, you know, this could be more of a neutral get the bandaid off.

Mike Papantonio:             Yes.

Farron Cousins:                  So everybody has the reaction before the actual decision.

Mike Papantonio:             That’s, that’s exactly right. Yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  And it’s one of those we’re gonna have to wait and see who, who it is, what the motive is, who they’re working for.

Mike Papantonio:             Okay. So, so who it is. Okay. Is it a progressive clerk? You know, whose career is now officially over.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah.

Mike Papantonio:             They may make her into, you know, the, make him or her into a hero. It’ll last about six months and their career is over. I mean, it really is. There’s no, because they all go to work for these silk stocking defense firms, you know, they don’t go to work for.

Farron Cousins:                  Conservative, liberal, doesn’t matter.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah. They don’t do what we do, plaintiff’s work. They wanna work for Wall Street law firms. So that careers over. They might be a hero for a little while, but it’s over. But you raised something that I, I want to ask you about. Your, your reaction was that maybe, maybe, just maybe it’s a conservative that is leaking this.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah. One, one.

Mike Papantonio:             Talk about that a little bit because that, I don’t know that I buy into it, but I think it’s a good argument.

Farron Cousins:                  Right. It’s just one of, you know, obviously several possibilities. One of the possibilities Slate even brings up is maybe this was a justice. That’s way too far fetched. But the conservative side of this is that right now we’ve got lots of states that currently are drafting legislation to limit abortion. So if a conservative.

Mike Papantonio:             Empowers them.

Farron Cousins:                  Right, they could have leaked this to say, hey, as you’re drafting this, keep in mind, we’re about to repeal the whole thing. So you don’t have to go with a 13 week ban. You can go with a no week ban.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  You know, you can change it. You can make it illegal. And this is what I’m afraid is gonna start happening. Make it illegal for somebody to leave your state to go to a blue state.

Mike Papantonio:             Ah.

Farron Cousins:                  To terminate a pregnancy.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah. Okay.

Farron Cousins:                  Texas is already attempting that obviously.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah, yeah.

Farron Cousins:                  So that’s what it will be.

Mike Papantonio:             Well, that’ll never happen. I mean that, that first of all, that is so unconstitutional. It’s beyond.

Farron Cousins:                  Well, we thought this would never happen too though. I mean.

Mike Papantonio:             Well.

Farron Cousins:                  We’re in the land of anything goes at this point.

Mike Papantonio:             You’re right. For me to say that it’s unconstitutional is almost meaningless anymore.

Farron Cousins:                  The Supreme Court, the Supreme Court’s a joke though and, and we have talked about that plenty of times in the past. This entire Supreme court top to bottom has become a joke. It’s all partisan hacks.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah. It’s a shame.

Farron Cousins:                  There’s no real rule of law.

Mike Papantonio:             And moreover, a lot of this law is established at the federal court level. I mean, it’s not, it’s not, you know, the Supreme Court matters obviously, but a lot of this is enforced at the federal court level and it can be, it can be moved around as people wanna move it around. A good lawyer can go in a federal court and they can make an argument. For example, just like Obamacare. I mean they almost decimated Obamacare in federal court right here in Pensacola, I think.

Farron Cousins:                  Yeah.

Mike Papantonio:             Yeah.

Mike Papantonio is an American attorney and television and radio talk show host. He is past president of The National Trial Lawyers, the most prestigious trial lawyer association in America; and is one of the few living attorneys inducted into the Trial Lawyer Hall of Fame. He hosts the international television show "America's Lawyer"; and co-hosts Ring of Fire Radio, a nationally syndicated weekly radio program, with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. and Sam Seder.