*This transcript was generated by a third-party transcription software company, so please excuse any typos.
Mike Papantonio: President Biden is packing his defense department with people from the defense industry, a sign that, that not much has really changed in American policy. Right. I’ll tell you what, this, this story, it takes me back to the Clinton era. All right. Let’s, and I wish I could say it wasn’t Obama, but he did the same thing.
Farron Cousins: He did.
Mike Papantonio: It’s almost that neoliberal thing, isn’t it?
Farron Cousins: Right, it really is.
Mike Papantonio: Neoliberal means we’re joined at the hip with Wall Street, where you used to be a Democrat. You used to be a liberal and you weren’t enamored with the idea that we’re, we’re pumping billions of dollars into the weapons industry. That’s exactly what’s going on here. Raytheon, Boeing, all, McDonnell Douglas, this is a, this is a payday for them, isn’t it?
Farron Cousins: Right. General Dynamics on that list too. And you have all these other smaller consultancy firms. You have Wall Street itself tied to the weapons industry. All of them have a seat at the table.
Mike Papantonio: Now.
Farron Cousins: With the Pentagon.
Mike Papantonio: They did last term.
Farron Cousins: They, they did.
Mike Papantonio: Trump.
Farron Cousins: Yeah.
Mike Papantonio: They did the term before that.
Farron Cousins: Exactly, because this is just how it works now. And I’m afraid too many people have come to accept that well, these people know it best. No, they don’t. What these people know is making a lot of money selling a lot of things that blow up. And what we’re doing is we’re blowing up civilians overseas. We, we know that. Reports have done that. I’m pretty sure we’ve done plenty of segments on that.
Mike Papantonio: Oh, we’ve done half a dozen stories.
Farron Cousins: You know, 90% of the time they miss their targets. So we know where the money is going and we know who the money is killing. And these are people going about their daily lives.
Mike Papantonio: Let’s add another feature to it. Here’s where it really gets interesting. When we think of the defense industry, we think a Northrop. We think of McDonnell Douglas. We think of Raytheon. We think of the folks that build weapons that kill people all over the world. Right. Now there’s a new development, Google, Microsoft, and again, Amazon. Okay. They’re in the, they’re now moving into the, the favorites of the DOD, the department of defense. Talk about that just a minute.
Farron Cousins: Right. These, these companies have been competing for a long time for these lucrative contracts. Let us handle all your cloud computing. Let us handle all your software needs. Let us handle any kind of digital aspect of war, which is where it’s all moving. Let us handle cyber security. And they’re getting so much money, billions and billions per year, from the defense industry that yes, you do have to classify Google and Amazon and Microsoft as defense contractors at this point, because so much money comes from there.
Mike Papantonio: Farron, how did we get to the point in this country where a guy, a person that calls themselves a liberal. Okay. I, I identify as a liberal, where we’re more lined up with the weapons industry than probably, you know, than everybody else. Understand that’s what’s happening here. And it seems to be okay. You know, let’s rattle sabers with Russia, let’s start a new cold war with Russia. Let’s go after China. That would scare the bejesus out of most liberals who have read Howard Zinn.
Farron Cousins: Yeah.
Mike Papantonio: You’ve interviewed Howard Zinn. Right. So let’s talk about that just a second. How have we gotten here? Got about 30 seconds.
Farron Cousins: You, you, always have these political realignments, and I think that’s what’s happening. The defense industry right now thinks that the Democratic party is more lucrative for them. So they pump more money in, they send their people to DC, they get them appointed to these positions and it does become more lucrative for them. You know, if there’s a shift in the Republican party in the future, maybe they’ll shift back. Maybe things are good with the Democrats and they ride that gravy train. But it’s, it’s sickening that so many voters accept it.
Mike Papantonio: Well, the idea of liberal doesn’t, it just means neoliberal. That’s what the new, corporations are fine, Wall Street’s fine, as long as they give the Democratic money, as long as they give the Democratic party money.
Farron Cousins: Yeah.
Mike Papantonio: Real upside down.